Salem is far from the only Oregon city to be struggling with balancing its budget amid rising costs and declining revenues. Leaders cite property tax limits, the end of pandemic aid money and inflation rates, among other factors. But as a capital city, it’s one that gets more attention than others. Earlier this year, Salem city residents reacted overwhelmingly negatively to big proposed cuts to the library in an attempt to address the shortfall. Those cuts were restored as a result — for now.
The city’s standing Budget Committee will present its recommendations to the city council during its meeting Monday evening, where time for public comment will be provided as well. We hear more details from Irvin Brown, the chair of that committee, which includes the mayor and all the members of the volunteer city council, as well as nine appointed community members. Brown has been serving as a community member, but in May he won a seat on the city council and will take that office in January.
Note: The following transcript was created by a computer and edited by a volunteer.
Dave Miller: This is Think Out Loud on OPB. I’m Dave Miller. Like many cities around the state, Salem is struggling to balance its budget amidst rising costs and flat revenue. Tonight, the city’s Budget Committee is going to present its recommendations for the new budget year to the city council. If it passes, one year stop-gaps will save some library and park services, but homeless services would see some big cuts. Irvin Brown is the chair of the Budget Committee and a city council member-elect. He’s going to take office in January, and he joins us now. It’s great to have you on the show.
Irvin Brown: Thank you for the invite.
Miller: Some services that had been on the chopping block – things like library positions, movies in the park – were saved with one-time funds. How did your committee make those individual decisions about those services that are safe for a year?
Brown: It was a collaborative effort. Any time you have to make a decision as to what you’re going to cut, it’s never easy. And if we go back to last year, there were several of us, including myself, who had put together a proposal for the payroll tax, and that failed in January.
Miller: Rather spectacularly.
Brown: Yeah, it failed last year, but the message was still true. The message is true that there are still some pretty difficult decisions ahead of us. So working collaboratively now, we’ve heard from the community, and that was one voice.
The second voice is, now, we’re coming back again, saying, “Hey, we’ve moved some funds” – as you mentioned about the library. So we got this stop-gap for one year. Come January, we’ll still have to make some hard decisions. As for firehouses, they are still on the chopping block. So when we think about going forward, the conversations just become more courageous, because we have some difficult decisions ahead of us. And every person who lives in Salem, they’re going to feel it.
Miller: Courageous seems like a nice way to put this. I mean, these are going to be heart wrenching decisions, right?
Brown: Yes. When you think about it … for example, a firehouse. First responders are key for our safety. There’s some individuals who may want to say, “Well, no, we don’t need any more police officers. We don’t need more first responders.” Well, I’m on the opposite side of that equation. And here’s the reason why. If you have an emergency, let’s say at 1:17 a.m. – whether it’s your spouse, your grandmother or maybe it could be your toddler for lack of breathing, and who knows what that is – but when you pick up your phone and you dial 911, there is an expectation that someone is going to show up at your house in a matter of minutes.
Now, knowing what we’re going to have to cut starting in January, that travel time that it takes a first responder in the city of Salem to get to your home is right around five minutes and 50 seconds. If we have to close some firehouses or even let go of more police officers, that five to six minutes will easily go up to eight or nine minutes. And now it’s a matter of life and death.
Miller: We zoomed ahead because all these things are interrelated to the cuts that are on the horizon. But I want to stick with the ones that are ahead of you right now, that the city council is going to be voting on in the coming, what, two weeks or so? So, library positions, movies in the park, those are safe, at least for a year. You are recommending a lot of cuts for people experiencing homelessness, including funding for micro-shelters at the city level, some social service grants, something like $600,000 in grants for homeless outreach programs. How did you decide on those cuts?
Brown: When you look at those cuts, for example, shelters, micro-shelters, we know currently that that system works. It works because we’re able to take individuals off the street and give them a place to lay their head at night. We also know, coming past this short legislative session, that there was $300 million that’s going to be pushed forward throughout Oregon to help with those homeless services.
So if we have money coming in from the Governor’s Office, we now know what we can cut. Because when you think about having to streamline some of those services for the homeless community, that allows us to almost balance the budget. Now we have to look at: what can we let go of and what are those things that we have to keep?
Miller: But is the new money coming from – normally I say from Salem, it’s confusing when we’re talking about the city of Salem – but coming from lawmakers, will that actually make up for the homeless outreach program grants? That’s more than half a million dollars. Or are you going to have to actually cut people who are working to either keep people off the streets or help them get into permanent housing? Will you actually be made whole?
Brown: Well, I would say it’s a both /and. Because even though we will have to make cuts to those particular services, there is no guarantee that there will not be additional cuts. So that’s the part where people who live in Salem, they’re going to feel this, because we have what we have throughout the state.
To make a long story short, there were some measures that were put in place back in the ‘90′s – Measures 5 and 50. You’ll get people to be on both sides of the coin when you start discussing these particular measures. But long story short, we have this gap between revenues and expenditures, meaning, we do not have enough funds from taxes coming into our general fund. And so it’s quickly depleted. And when it’s depleted, you’re left in a situation that we’re currently in right now.
Miller: What were the hardest decisions that you feel like you had to make personally? This is something like an 18-19 person committee. You were not in this alone, but for you personally, what did you see as the hardest decisions? If it was we put money towards this and not this, what was hardest?
Brown: For me, I would say it’s having to let go of vacancies that are with first responders. When I consider my own safety, as a Person of Color, safety means a lot to me. When we live in such a climate that is very divisive – politically, socially, economically – it is very divisive. So what’s priority for me is my safety. As a Person of Color, there are not a lot of People of Color who live in the city of Salem. And then when you start doing the math, when you ask yourself, well, how many elected officials are People of Color, the number is even smaller. So for me, it was really difficult to say, “OK, we gotta cut some of these positions,” knowing all the while that I’m putting my safety and my neighbor’s safety at risk.
Miller: These are unfilled positions that were still on the books. And if they are being cut, it means that instead of, at some point, theoretically hiring someone for them, those positions are simply disappearing?
Brown: Correct. They’re gone.
Miller: What one-time funds did you use to plug some of these holes?
Brown: Library, for instance – the community, we heard from them loud and clear that they do not want their library cut, they do not want those services cut, they do not want those individuals to lose their jobs. And I get it. Here’s the reason I get it. When you look at the library services within the city of Salem, most of those individuals who have those jobs, they’re People of Color. So, now, you have to ask yourself, if we close the library, we also now are going to impact families, not just any families, but those Families of Color.
Secondly, when you think about cutting those library services, we were able to basically move some funds around, from our tourism, our TAT Fund. We were able to move some funds around just to make sure that it stays open for at least another year.
Miller: Are library services more important than first responder services?
Brown: Are you asking me personally or just in general?
Miller: I’m not sure what it would mean for you to answer this question. I mean, I think it has to be answered personally, because this is what we’re talking about. The challenge of this role is, you have to make these hard decisions, so I do mean it personally to you.
Brown: We do have to. I’m going to go back to the scenario I mentioned, that if someone is on your property at one o’clock in the morning and someone … and this happened to me. Just a few months ago, there was someone on my property, it was in the midnight hour and I was shaking out of my boots, like “Who is this person?” And they were pacing up in front of my front door. And long story short, I was able to reach out to one of the deputy chiefs and they were able to get somebody over to my home to basically canvass the whole area. So when I think about priority for me, it’s safety.
Do I want the libraries to stay open? Yes. However, at the end of the day, at 1:17 in the morning, I know that I’m not going to be calling my librarian to come to my rescue. And that may be hard to hear, but that’s the truth of the matter. The truth of the matter is that every individual is concerned about their safety. Even if you don’t think it’s a top priority, you do want to be safe, you want your family to be safe.
Miller: What fee or charge increases are you asking the city council to consider?
Brown: Well, tonight the city council will meet, and tonight they’re actually going to start discussing what type of fees. And I can almost guarantee some of those are gonna be some operational fees. When I say operational fees, we still have one more meeting where the revenue task force will meet, they’ll meet in two weeks. And so the council will meet tonight, the revenue task force, they will come back in two more weeks. And, going forward, I’m optimistic that we’re going to be able to see exactly what fees we’re going to be able to increase.
Miller: We had the incoming mayor and current city council member, Julie Hoy, on the show recently, a few weeks ago. I asked her if she thought there was an urgent need for more revenue in the city of Salem. She said she wasn’t sure, that she didn’t have enough information now. And essentially, she said that it might be a question, not of structural revenue issues that you’re talking about and that the current outgoing mayor has talked about, but instead, maybe it’s just a question of misspending or inefficiencies.
The sense I got is, once she gets there as mayor and has a better chance to look under the hood and to look under the couch cushions, maybe this whole thing will be fine. What’s your response to that?
Brown: I’ve been on the budget committee now, this is roughly my fifth year. When I moved to the city of Salem, there was not an individual that was serving on the city council for the budget team. So within Ward 5, there was no representation there. So that told me, hey, there’s something going on about Ward 5, maybe not been engaged enough in good governance, just knowing what’s happening in the city. And now that you fast forward, I’ve gone from being a vice chair of this committee to the chair, and soon to be a counselor. And this is what I would tell you or to any individual that lives in Salem: I’ve read the budget, I’ve gone through it, tooth and nail. I’ve looked at it with a fine tooth comb, I’ve gone through it and we do have a revenue problem. There’s just not enough money coming in.
I’ll put it to the test for you. The budget that we’re going to propose going forward is gonna be roughly $925 million. The budget that we just came out of was roughly $725 million. So we are increasing by the numbers, but we are doing it with less people, with less services. And for the past couple of decades, we have not increased our services as employees for the city of Salem. So we are doing more with less. And in the past 10 years, we have had over roughly 26,000 people move into the city, but everything remains the same when it comes to what goes into the general fund.
Miller: In terms of the number of police officers or librarians or sanitation workers.
Brown: Yes, nothing has changed. And if you want to even put me to task, if you go through the State of Oregon, if you want to find a city that’s relatively the same, when it comes to the numbers and services, that would be Eugene.
Miller: Almost an identical population.
Brown: Yes. And here’s what you may not find out. Eugene right now has over 1,000 more employees, over 1,000 more than the city of Salem, which tells us they are doing more to service their families.
Miller: Are they paying more in taxes?
Brown: Yes, so when we think about what they’re doing and how they’re doing it, we have to find a different way. I’m a firm believer that we have to reach those individuals that are far to the left. We have to reach those individuals that are far to the right. And we have to find a compromise somewhere in the middle when it comes to our lawmakers.
Miller: Well, when you say lawmakers …
Brown: Legislators.
Miller: At the state level.
Brown: At the state level.
Miller: Because you don’t see a local fix to this. I mean, a version of a local fix was the payroll tax that was roundly defeated, that you championed and that the incoming mayor was a big voice against.
Brown: Correct.
Miller: So you’re not looking for a revenue increase, a revenue fix, at the city level?
Brown: So, two things. The first one is, yes, I’m looking for a short-term fix. When the revenue task team comes back, we’re gonna take a look at their recommendations. I’m confident that they’re gonna come back with some really good suggestions.
Miller: What are examples of what you’re thinking is actually gonna be on the table for increasing revenue at the city level?
Brown: I believe the revenue task team, I think they’re gonna come back and say, taxes. I really do. I think they’re gonna look at taxes. I think they’re gonna take a stronger look at operational fees at the city level. I do believe that. Yet at the state level, this is the part where some may not be able to connect the dots and I’ll connect the dots real quick.
This past short session, we had House Bill 4072, payment in lieu of taxes. And basically, that particular bill would say, Madam Governor, we would like for you to start paying taxes on your buildings and your properties, because that would allow us to get anywhere from $5 [million] to $7 million into the general fund. Now, it’s not going to fix it immediately, but I’m going to be one of the counselors to say to Madam Governor, “hey, cut us a check,” and then turn around and say, “for five years back, how can you support us?” Because this is not something that happened last year, two years ago. This has been a process that’s been going on for a while.
Miller: The governor would have to sign that, but it’s lawmakers, 90 of them, who saw that bill this year and said, “Nah, we’ve got other priorities.” Why should lawmakers all around the state give the city of Salem more money?
Brown: I’ll tell you why. I think when it comes to lawmakers, whether you’re far to the left or to the right or someplace in the middle, I’m a firm believer that having a spirit of collaboration and humility go hand in hand. Now, set that on the side.
When I think about, again, the scenario I mentioned earlier about public safety, every individual deserves the right to be safe in their home. Every individual deserves that right when they pick up the phone and they need someone to come to their home, if they have been injured or someone’s at their door trying to cause hurt and harm, I’m a firm believer that every lawmaker will want that. So we now have to find a way to convince them that this is what the capital city needs.
Miller: It’s interesting, though, to me, that you talked earlier about Measures 5 and 50. Those are the statewide property tax limit measures that Oregonians said yes to sequentially in the ‘90′s. The fix you’re talking about here is a Salem-specific fix, as opposed to a general overhaul of the way property taxes are tabulated and increased in the state. Is that because you don’t see that as politically viable right now?
Brown: Correct.
Miller: Irvin Brown, we will talk again.
Brown: I’m looking forward to it.
Miller: Irvin Brown is soon to be a member of the Salem City Council. He was elected in May. He’ll take over one of those seats in January. He is currently the chair of the Salem Budget Committee.
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