Rep. Janelle Bynum of Oregon rallies against Elon Musk

Democrats continue to struggle over how to counter President Donald Trump and the unprecedented governmental power he has given to billionaire Elon Musk, the world’s richest man. Recently, Democrats banded together to fight against the unelected “special government employee” through protests and policy proposals.

Democrats are among those who say the country is at the brink of a constitutional crisis, as the Trump administration has suggested it may not abide by judicial rulings it disagrees with.

U.S. Rep. Janelle Bynum spoke at a “Nobody Elected Elon” rally last week. She joins us to share more about her concerns and what lawmakers are doing to respond.

Note: The following transcript was transcribed digitally and validated for accuracy, readability and formatting by an OPB volunteer.

Dave Miller: From the Gert Boyle studio at OPB, this is Think Out Loud. I’m Dave Miller. Democrats continue to struggle over how to counter President Donald Trump, and the unprecedented governmental power he has given to Elon Musk, the world’s richest person. Members of the party did band together to fight against the unelected special government employee through protests and policy proposals. Janelle Bynum is one of the Democrats who is making her voice heard. The first term representative from Oregon’s 5th congressional district spoke at a Nobody Elected Elon rally last week, and she joins us now. Welcome back to Think Out Loud.

Janelle Bynum: Thanks for having me.

Miller: I want to start by playing a short clip from Elon Musk’s press conference in the Oval Office yesterday, because it’s maybe one of his fuller encapsulations of what his team has been doing. Let’s have a listen.

Elon Musk [recording]: If there’s not a good feedback loop from the people to the government, and if you have rule of the bureaucrat, if the bureaucracy is in charge, then what meaning does democracy actually have? If the people cannot vote and have their will be decided by their elected representatives in the form of the president and and the senate and the house, then we don’t live in a democracy, we live in a bureaucracy. So it’s incredibly important that we close that feedback loop, we fix that feedback loop, and that the public’s elected representatives, the president, the house and the senate, decide what happens, as opposed to a large unelected bureaucracy.

This is not to say that there aren’t some good… there are good people who are in the federal bureaucracy. But you can’t have an autonomous federal bureaucracy. You have to have one that is responsive to the people. That’s the whole point of a democracy.

Miller: Janelle Bynum, what’s your response?

Bynum: It’s interesting that he’s using the term “feedback loop.” As an engineer, I totally get it. What he’s alluding to is a feedback loop that includes just people from one side of an issue. One of the things I learned in being a legislator is if you want the laws that you make or the policies that you make or the structure that you’re building to be durable, you have to hear from a multitude of voices.

And so right now what they’re practicing, I would say, is gaslighting. What they’re practicing is trying to turn neighbor against neighbor. They’re not focusing on lowering costs. They’re going after a working class of people, masquerading as if it’s progress. And it’s actually setting us back, and harming working families.

Miller: What have you been hearing from your constituents about Elon Musk and DOGE?

Bynum: They’re very concerned about how it’s hitting their communities. Whether it’s funding for Medicaid, whether it’s just the indiscriminate slashing and burning of government, they’re very concerned in that way.

When I talked with Republicans in the district, and the perimeter of the district, what they were telling me was they wanted to make sure that they were hearing the truth. So what I started to do was to try and listen to... like this morning I was listening to Newsmax. And I was trying to figure out where people were getting their information from. And based on that, I would say that was informing their opinions on how to feel.

Miller: What did you take away from that?

Bynum: The very quick, succinct messaging is effective on some people who aren’t normally necessarily engaged in politics. But the body at large, the people, the electorate, they told me ‒ and I can only tell you what they told me and what I interpreted ‒ was that the status quo wasn’t working for them. I agreed to go to Washington, and what I shared that I would do is be a part of a group of people who would disrupt the status quo.

And where I think President Trump and Elon Musk are missing it is that when you’re a disrupter, you don’t destroy. And that is the part I think that is terribly, terribly concerning with the way in which they’re going about their actions, what they’re actually doing, and the long term ramifications.

Miller: So far, it has been the courts, not congress, that have provided the only check on the executive’s power. What role do you see congress playing, given that Republicans broadly are very much on board with the president’s agenda and actions, and you Democrats are in the minority?

Bynum: So this is technical and boring, what I’m about to explain to you. But congress does not have standing. I’ll put it in layman’s terms. If I wanted to make a complaint to my local school board about how I saw another child treated, I can’t. Because I don’t have standing, based on the way the school board rules are written. Only that parent or only that child has standing. In the very same way, congress does not have standing to bring lawsuits forward. And given that Republicans in the house have a three-seat majority, Democrats in congress can only become a party of opposition. That is the role, that’s the shakeout. I think it’s helpful for Oregonians to understand what the limitations are.

Here’s the other point. Martin Luther King talked about disobeying unjust laws. I suspect we are getting close to a place where people are realizing how unjust some things are, and how they’re turning neighbor against neighbor, or how many people in this country have been left behind, and how many more will be left behind as a result of Trump’s policies and the way in which he’s going about things.

Miller: On Monday, we talked to your Democratic colleague Val Hoyle, who hinted at the threat of a government shutdown as a way to exert leverage in the upcoming budget vote. There’s about a month left. How much is that a topic of conversation in your caucus, and how much do you think Republicans would care about a government shutdown?

Bynum: I think it’s really dangerous to think that it’s okay for our government to shut down again, and that people would use a shutdown as a political tool. When the government does shut down, it harms the people who actually are doing the work, but it also harms the people who need to receive the services. As simple as something as getting your passport. That may seem like a minor inconvenience to some, but that affects our business, that affects our ability to live a thriving life. These are real things that our government is supposed to provide. Or, for instance, the granting of a fund that will help fix a sewer in a particular community. Those are real things. And so to wage war with a government shutdown is really, really difficult for me to stomach.

Miller: Given what we’re talking about, is there any legislation that you think you can actually pass this term, legislation with bipartisan appeal?

Bynum: Well, we just introduced legislation yesterday, because our office is focusing on costs, jobs, and quality of life. And so with Troy Downing out of Montana, I introduced a bill on access to capital for rural small businesses. And we know that if small businesses can thrive, our downtown, our main street, the American dream can thrive. And so that’s what we’re working on.

I am looking for every glimmer of hope. I’m not focused on a lot of the more heated rhetoric. I’m focused on the nuts and bolts of a quality of life, and growing jobs, and limiting costs.

Miller: Janelle Bynum, thanks very much.

Bynum: Thanks.

Miller: Janelle Bynum is the Democratic representative from Oregon’s 5th congressional district.

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