Could Uber be headed to Pendleton?

There’s currently one taxi company offering rides in Pendleton, but now some residents say they want ride-hailing companies to be allowed to come to town. We hear more about where Pendleton stands now and how it hopes to update ride-hailing policies, especially for busy events like Round-Up and Whisky Music Fest. Dale Primmer is a Pendleton city councilor. He joins us with details.

The following transcript was created by a computer and edited by a volunteer:

Dave Miller: From the Gert Boyle Studio at OPB, this is Think Out Loud. I’m Dave Miller. There is currently only one taxi company doing business in Pendleton. And so- called ride share companies like Uber or Lyft are not allowed to operate. Some Pendletonians want to change that. They’re asking the city council to amend the rules. They say they want the freedom to drive for Uber or to be taken around by an Uber driver. The taxi company has argued that there is not enough business in town to go around. That was where things stood until this week when a possible compromise emerged. For the details on all of this, I’m joined by Dale Primmer. He is a member of the Pendleton City Council. Dale Primmer, welcome.

Dale Primmer: Hey how are ya?

Miller: Doing great. Thanks for joining us. As I mentioned, there’s currently one taxi company doing business in Pendleton. Can you give us a sense for the services that they provide?

Primmer: Sure. So the taxi company provides services 22 hours a day as per the ordinance. They do a variety of things:  ADA transports, medical transport, people that might need to go to the emergency room but the ambulance isn’t necessary. They have a program called dial a ride, which is for folks that can schedule in advance to get picked up at their home to take through various appointments.

They also provide the drivers for our city buses, and of course then they do typical fare kind of cab service.

Miller: The drivers for the city buses are hired by the taxi company?

Primmer: Correct. They provide the drivers for the city buses for public transportation.

Miller: And also just maybe what people would think of first and foremost, what a lot of people think of in terms of taxis, they’ve had a couple of drinks there at a bar and they want to go home safely.

Primmer: Yeah, correct. Which is also the same argument that people want Uber for.

Miller: Right, so what are your biggest concerns about having Uber come to town?

Primmer: So, the concerns that I’ve heard from folks, are the taxi company that we have – and again we’ve gone out every year or two, I can’t remember if it’s a biennial contract or annual contract, but it’s not like there’s multiple cab companies that want to come do business in Pendleton Oregon. In fact, I think that the cab company we have has been a single applicant for many years.  But the concern that we have is that they already run, or reportedly run on such a narrow margin that should Uber come in and operate during those more profitable times a day, that margin will shrink to a point that they can no longer operate. And in that event are they no longer able to provide the basic needs for people who are the most vulnerable? So you have folks that use the taxi service to get to doctor’s appointments or to grocery stores or to various things like that. And if Uber comes in [and] draws enough business out of the cab company that they go out of business, what you’re left with is a handful of Ubers that might not be able to meet the basic needs of those most vulnerable. They won’t be available during the hour they need them to be and they’re afraid of losing that.

Miller: My understanding is that some people mistakenly drove for Uber in Pendleton already apparently not realizing that it wasn’t allowed. Do you know how long that went on for?

Primmer: I don’t know. That is what generated the conversation. I think the person who has brought this to the council and is seeking for some change was driving for Uber, had some issue that came up and contacted the police and indicated they were an Uber driver and they just kind of witnessed something that they wanted to report, and the police at that point informed them of the ordinance that required taxi services to be available X hours a day and with set schedules and things like that, that independent contractors that work for Uber can’t guarantee, [and] therefore didn’t qualify under the current ordinance. We were informed of that and they used that as motivation to come to the council and seek change.

Miller: I think that there have been two city council meetings. The second was this week and you heard input from both the people seeking to drive for Uber, and the owners of Elite Tax, the company that operates now. Can you describe the compromise that came forward from that meeting?

Primmer: Well I think there’s still work to be done on that. I think the folks from Uber came in and described why they believe that there should be more options in the community. And quite frankly their comments are probably the most common comments that I’ve heard. I’ve heard a lot of support for that argument.  [They] wanted to be able to operate and provide additional services just for the community as well as to bolster support when we have large events that come to town. Pendleton’s economy has a lot of tourism activities that come along that grow our communities significantly during certain times a year, and to meet that demand would be helpful. I certainly agree with that.  Then Elite came in and described much of what I just said before, that especially post-covid, the number of the calls for services have declined significantly and they don’t have much room to lose revenue before they’re just unable to operate. So they proposed some hours of operations, but they might be able to commingle. I started brainstorming with how that might look and they’ve agreed that there’s going to be an ongoing work group that can kind of put the parameters together for a pilot, where the two different agencies or entities can coexist, operate, look at what kind of data we can extrapolate from that to determine what other consequences would turn out to be real versus what we imagine they might be yet not experiencing them yet, and come out with some recommendations that might ultimately shape reforming the ordinance moving forward.

Miller: And so what’s been reported is one possibility would be the taxi company could have exclusive rights to give people rides during the day from the morning to maybe eight p.m. or so, and then Uber drivers could drive after that. So some version of that seems like it could be the eventual pilot?

Primmer: Yeah, I think that’s what we described so far. I think what we’ve decided [is that] we were going to do is put a work group together that includes a city staff person that works on all things transportation, the city attorney who obviously works on the ordinances and crafting languages, and then the two parties to come together and kind of hammer out hours of operation what that might look like, how that might look. Ultimately in terms of a delivery, run a delivery model for a period of time. What kind of data do we need to determine, what kind of effect it’s having, positive or negative, that ultimately will shape how we might craft modifications to the ordinance. So that’s where it’s at now, I think where we left it as a group. Again, I’m one of nine. So this is my understanding of the conversations we’ve had that that group will come back to us with a recommendation on how they might structure a pilot to operate, where both agencies can coexist.

Miller: Do you have the ability as a city to enforce a time restriction like that? I’m asking because a couple of years ago in Portland and in other cities, there are a lot of questions about Uber flouting local rules and operating in ways that the city’s number of cities hadn’t allowed. Would you have the ability of law enforcement in Pendleton to really crack down on an Uber driver driving at 4pm?

Primmer: I don’t know the answer to that Dave. I think  as most of these kinds of things, they get drawn to the police departments, come into their field of vision based on some number of complaints or some kind of report. So I don’t know to what degree that would occur or not. I’m confident that [if] our Police department was aware that there were violations of ordinance that they would do their job and notify people of what the ordinances are. I don’t think we’re looking, or have a desire to take some law enforcement heavy handed approach. I think the reality of it is, I think there’s a lot of people that want to see options in our community, they want to see  the convenience of Uber. And one of the counselors brought up in the meeting the other day that they’re not even convinced that necessarily Uber and the cab company really work within the same market space, that there are people that will use an Uber that currently don’t utilize the cab company. They might be relying on family members, or they might be, in the example you used earlier, of somebody going out for drinks and somebody being the designated DD. They may not want to wait the time it takes for a cab, but they can look at the app on their Uber, and say “hey, there’s a driver three minutes away”, poke the button, then get picked up. I think that’s part of the pilot, would really be to pull that apart, and actually see, are they in fact competing within the same market space? I mean there likely will be some crossover, but I don’t think it’s necessarily a fact that there will be a subtraction from, as opposed to maybe in addition to.

Miller: Dale Primmer, thanks for joining us today.

Primmer: You’re welcome.

Miller: That’s Dale Primmer. He is a member of the Pendleton City Council.

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